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Wolfgang
Reply with quote  #61 
Has anybody tried the AudiophileOptimizer?

https://www.highend-audiopc.com/shop/en/audiophileoptimizer

Is WIN server 2012R2 really necessary for best results or is WIN 10 enough?
Wolfgang
Reply with quote  #62 
I forgot to mention that the BIOS/EFI settings (p.9-17 in the AudiophileOptimizer pdf manual)work with JPlay as well and kicks it up a few notches. Worth to try!
Ray P
Reply with quote  #63 

I installed Windows 10 Home on an Intel E3815 processor based computer over the weekend and last evening I installed JPlay on top. Sourcing music files from an Asset UPnP library on my home NAS, everything worked fine and I enjoyed listening via my headphone amp for an hour or so without a glitch.

The only limitation is that I only had the option of Wasapi playback with JPlay but that is because I only have the generic Microsoft driver for my USB device installed. It's proving ifficult to track down the correct Win10 driver for the USB sound card and the Win8 version doesn't work. The USB sound card in the headphone amp is a DIYINHK board using a C-media CM6631A so if anyone knows of the correct driver. My MP headphone amp project will have a JLSounds USB board, which uses an XMOS processor and for which I have a Win10 driver so it won't be a problem.

Anyway, the important thing to note is that Intel E3815 is a low power single-core processor so it means that low-cost low-power computers (such as Intel NUCs and the like) are viable as JPlay renderers. Low power also means that passive cooling, which means no moving parts (like fans), and therefore silent operation of the computer, is viable.

Later in the week I will use the Intel E3815 computer as the 'Audio Computer' in a JPlay dual computer set up, though I'm not expecting any improvement because the current setup, with the music library on a seperate NAS, is essentially a dual computer configuration.

Ray P
Reply with quote  #64 
I tracked down a Win10 driver this evening and now have JPlay operating in Kernel Streaming mode; well worth the effort, better resolution and a richer sound - instruments have a wonderful natural timbre.

So, on with the DAC build!
Wolfgang
Reply with quote  #65 
Ray, did you try the "Computer Audio Design Windows 8 Optimization Script V2.6.zip" (should work also with Win 10)and the BIOS settings  or did you listen with the original settings?

It looks like the  Intel NUC board doesn't allow to install regular PCie cards, only half size. Do you think the built-in USB 3 is good enough? At least with my single PC setup a dedicated USB card improved things a lot.

Will you try the Win server 2012R2 dual PC with JPlay?
Ray P
Reply with quote  #66 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfgang
did you try the "Computer Audio Design Windows 8 Optimization Script V2.6.zip" (should work also with Win 10)and the BIOS settings  or did you listen with the original settings?


No, I haven't used any scripts but I have done some optimization myself by turning things off in the BIOS and Windows (or uninstalling components within Windows). I also run the computer headless, controlling it via TeamViewer.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfgang
Do you think the built-in USB 3 is good enough?


It sounds pretty good to me and with the NUC motherboard I don't have the option of trying USB daughterboards andway. I suspect there will be more mileage in trying a linear power supply some time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfgang
Will you try the Win server 2012R2 dual PC with JPlay?


No, I'm not planning to buy a Windows server licence; the code will be essentially the same as Windows 10 anyway. I will use Windows 10 for both computers.
Kelvin Tyler
Reply with quote  #67 
It seems clear that any PC or Mac music server should have a 'sparse' OS installation and be a dedicated machine. I rather like Ray P's  use of a compact style PC. Personally, I have been very much enjoying using JPlay on my Win10 booted Mac Mini with my Soekris DAC1541. I have also got very good sounding  results on this machine under Mac OS 10.7 with Bit Perfect and DSD Master software using iTunes for just file selection. This latter setup is very easy to use 'headless' with an iPad running Remote. See http://www.psaudio.com/ps_how/how-to-build-a-music-server .
IMHO, using a full blown OS like Win10, only to uninstall as much as possible and limit it in many other ways, is not a technically sweet approach, although I accept it does give highly acceptable results. I always feel a little uncertain I have reached the limit of useful adjustments. I sometimes wonder if a simpler OS might not be desirable (back to DOS!! [wink] ). I note that Martin Brennan uses nothing more than a Raspberry Pi on his B2 machine which has SPDIF optical output and handles FLAC files. Just a few thoughts.
Kelvin
Wolfgang
Reply with quote  #68 
I think the main benefit of using a MAC or a PC for computer audio is the ease and versatility and being able to use – especially in the case of PC – a lot of readily available hardware like audiophile USB cards for example. That makes it worth to go the route of disabling a lot of existing services rather than using minimalistic Raspberry/Linux set-up which has obviously different problems.
AudiophileOptimizer goes in the direction of using DOS, disabling the GUI. And JPlay in hibernation mode goes in a similar direction during playback.
What I like best with JPlay/PC is that I have so many options that can influence the sound. I am not limited to one or two adjustments but can fine tune the sound very precisely to my expectations. Disabling more back ground processes or changing settings doesn’t always sound more realistic and better. If that’s the case I simply undo the change with a mouse click which is also why a computer is such a wonderful instrument for fine tuning after the hardware part (amps, cables, clean power etc) is at its max performance level.
Most filter changes in the DAC are almost too much change for my feeling (I tested about 20 with the Soekris DAC). I get best results using the most “neutral” sounding original DAC filter doing the fine tuning with PC /buffer settings etc. in little steps. It's very easy to share prt screen pics of settings (regedit, services etc) if somebody in this forum wants to try and needs something to start with.
Kelvin Tyler
Reply with quote  #69 
Excellent post, Wolfgang. You have summarized the overall situation most clearly and I agree with most of what you say.
I guess we are at opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to aural discrimination. I am probably much less sensitive to 'fine-tuning' than yourself. Long may that facility remain with you and the obvious enjoyment it brings.
As I said above I like JPlay very much. I must try it in hibernation mode on a 'true' PC. All very interesting.
Regards,
Kelvin

Ray P
Reply with quote  #70 
Kelvin, here's a link to the Intel NUC PC I've been experimenting with;

https://www.quietpc.com/int-nuc-de3815tykhe

Although the page say's its discontinued you can still pick them up at reasonable prices - check out ebay for example. To make it functional you would need a memory board (4Gb) and a suitable solid state disk (32-60Gb is more than big enough, SSD to have silent running) and a copy of Windows 10 (I bought an OEM licence for Win 10 for about £20.
Kelvin Tyler
Reply with quote  #71 
Thanks very much, Ray. Very neat. Actually, hibernate mode in JPlay works fine on my Win10 booted Mac Mini.
Kelvin
ed schilling
Reply with quote  #72 
Almost all of this thread is way above my head. That said, I've had  "computer audio" for many years using many different computers and DACs. Right now we have about 4 TB of movies and music on a few external HDs. 

We have had a few of these for over a year and one is used for TV and computer audio. It plugs into our 4K UHD TV. We can play all audio files, movies off the hard drives and You Tube videos. The TV has an optical out and I just run that into my DAC (Tube Cal Audio Labs). The audio is quite good. 

Of course there are better ways to do this stuff but this is easy for me and does sound "good enough".

You need the thing, a powered hub, external HD or 2 or 3 for extra storage, wireless keyboard and mouse and of course a TV or monitor with HDMI. We just use the big TV but in the past I've used a small monitor. It's better hooked to the TV! There is a lot of stuff to watch! 

So, here is the thing.......   https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883800012&cm_re=compute_stick-_-83-800-012-_-Product

Having a computer hooked to the TV is great.......  This is in 720P and very funny, especially if you like "real" cars [smile]     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldD2rdLd7eI

And this one is just "pretty to listen to and watch"...Spirit In The Sky............

Both are best in 720P.
Ed



carson.
Reply with quote  #73 
I've just experimented with a RPi 3 and an Allo Boss DAC (not multibit as appropriate for this thread), but works with 24/192 and DSD. For the price, simplicity, and low power...I'm impressed. If I can get it to work with a 128 or 512GB SD card...makes things even more simple.

Allo actually makes a Raspberry type computer from the ground up for audio. I'm definitely in the "I need to simplify my life" mode. I might give it a try when I return to the states.

Thought'd I'd share for the folks not wanting to mess with BIOS, regedit or bootcamping, etc

Ray P
Reply with quote  #74 
Quote:
Originally Posted by carson.
Thought'd I'd share for the folks not wanting to mess with BIOS, regedit or bootcamping, etc


Just to be clear, any mentions of BIOS, regedit or bootcamping are relevant to JPlay, not the Soekris R2R DAC.

The original topic of this thread was the Soekris range of 'off the shelf' R2R DACs (as used by Kelvin) that you just plug in (to USB) and enjoy music.

R2R DACs, espeically those, like the Soekris, that use resistor ladders made up of discrete components (rather than an integrated DAC chip) are different to most of the DACs available today and R2R is generally thought to sound more natural and music (which is why there is a strong following of the old Phillips TDA R2R DAC chips).

JPlay is a Windows based music player package that several of us have been using and, strictly speaking, is off topic. BTW, JPlay will work perfectly and deliver some of the very best sound quality available without going anywhere near BIOS settings, dual-booting or registry editing.


Kelvin Tyler
Reply with quote  #75 
I was on the point of buying a compact PC for experimental music serving of the type which Ray P has been trying when I read Ed's note re a 'stick PC'. For considerably less than £($)100, I opted for an AWOW stick which has Win10 Home preloaded. I added a 64Gbyte microSD card and, after making the necessary connections for keyboard, mouse, monitor and Soekris DAC, I applied power... instant success! The DAC was connected to the USB3 port on the stick. JPlay runs happily and made for very pleasant listening, even, as Ray P noted, with no adjustments to Win10. The enclosed picture gives some idea of the tiny scale of this thing.
Kelvin

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